Peptide of the Week: Testosterone Esters + TRT Protocols – Hormone Optimization & Healing With Dr. Scott Collie Peptide of the Week https://peptideoftheweekpod.com/episodes/peptide-of-the-week-testosterone-esters-trt-protocols-hormone-optimization-heali/transcript We are not doctors. The content on this site is for educational and informational purposes only and is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure, or prevent any disease. Any compounds discussed may be intended for research purposes only. Use at your own risk. Amounts, timing and cycle lengths below are reported as the named speaker described them. Nothing here is a protocol to follow. --- 0:01 Speaker 0: Ultra running shoes are all about space. 0:04 Speaker 0: The space to go further, to feel better, 0:07 Speaker 0: to do something you never thought possible. 0:09 Speaker 0: And this space starts with ultra fit. Unlike traditional running shoes, ultra Fit gives toes more room to move naturally, 0:17 Speaker 0: so every step is strong, balanced, 0:19 Speaker 0: and comfortable. Whatever you're lacing up for, stay out there with Ultra. Shop now at ultrarunning.com. 0:26 Speaker 0: That's altrarunning.com. 0:39 Speaker 1: Welcome back to the pep time of the week podcast. 0:41 Speaker 1: I'm your host JD Denim, and always my good buddy, my business partner and my friend, 0:47 Speaker 1: T. Hoss, right across the way. What's up, dude? What's up? I'm not done yet though. I'm not done yet, ladies and gentlemen. And we have our 1st guest 0:54 Speaker 1: since the podcast studio has been set up and ready to rock. 0:58 Speaker 1: He's a good friend of ours. He's a good friend of mine. 1:02 Speaker 1: I am going to introduce him as Doctor. Scott Colley. He likes to be Doctor. Scott. 1:08 Speaker 1: I might slip up and say, Scotty, because I've known him before. He was doctor before his name. I've known him for 30 years. Good friend of mine. You're actually the godfather of my daughter, so that's how close we are. 1:19 Speaker 1: He's here to talk about some cool stuff and we'll get into that shortly, but welcome to the show, dude. Thank you. It's great to be here. Thanks again for having me back, JD. I appreciate it. Yeah, that last 1 was episode was great. 1:30 Speaker 3: You were at your office and, 1:33 Speaker 3: yeah, it was the 1st time 1:35 Speaker 3: that we've done this and you didn't really have much a camera. You're like, I don't know, I think my computer's got a camera on it maybe. That's right. Or old guys in computers. Microphone? 1:43 Speaker 1: Old guys in computers, man. I'm like, Brian, not a headphone. Yeah. Yeah. 1:48 Speaker 1: Well, but like, this is gonna fun. This is gonna 1:52 Speaker 1: be fun. Is gonna be fun. So 1 of the cool things that we talk about and 1 of the things I love sitting down and having this podcast in particular with Will is because we freaking love this stuff. We'll end up having these conversations 2:05 Speaker 1: long before we even had a peptide podcast on our radar. Long before that, we've been talking about this for 7, 8 years and 2:12 Speaker 1: you're the same. You're the same. You're going be, you and I will get on the phone and talk about different supplements just like Will and I would talk about different supplements. So this should a lot of fun. 3 dudes that love to talk about 2:24 Speaker 1: this stuff. So for 2:26 Speaker 1: you guys at home, what we're going to talk about is I think we're going to start with some blood work because that's, we're going to be talking about testosterone replacement and some different things in testosterone. 2:35 Speaker 1: But because we're talking about hormones, hormones are going to be a little bit separate to peptides. I don't think you necessarily need your blood work for peptides. 2:43 Speaker 1: Do for hormones. You do for testosterone. 2:45 Speaker 1: So 2:47 Speaker 1: I think we start with that. I think let's start a little bit with the 2:51 Speaker 1: blood work. Scott is who runs my blood work. 2:56 Speaker 1: He goes deep. He does a deep panel. He not 3:00 Speaker 1: only runs the deep panel, he explains why this hits this and this hits that unlike 3:04 Speaker 1: any doctor that I've ever sat down with. So let's talk a little bit about blood work, why it's important, why men, I think of any age and women, 3:13 Speaker 1: should be running blood work, 3:15 Speaker 1: especially if they're thinking about getting a testosterone replacement, 3:19 Speaker 1: men and women. Sure. 3:21 Speaker 2: Yeah. I think that 3:23 Speaker 2: there is some, you 3:25 Speaker 2: always want to get a baseline 1st of all, right? If you're going to start on any type of a hormone, you kind of want to see where you're at naturally. 3:31 Speaker 2: And the reason why that is because when you start a hormone replacement 3:35 Speaker 2: therapy, 3:37 Speaker 2: you got to retest after, but I usually retested about 6 weeks and run those levels to make sure that we're not over, we're not under. After you start? After you start. Yeah. Okay. But before that, even backing up before that, you also want to look at other things on the blood work because, 3:52 Speaker 2: you know, hormones do affect blood work. We know that, right? And it could be in a positive way and sometimes it could be in a negative way. There are people who come to me that I might ask them because their blood work is such a disaster. 4:03 Speaker 2: There might be things that I might ask them to do 1st to maybe get a little healthier 1st before 4:08 Speaker 2: jumping on a program of hormone. What would that be? What would it Oh, man, if you had like elevated homocysteine 4:15 Speaker 2: levels, you might have inflammatory markers that are elevated, really high hematocrit. 4:19 Speaker 2: If there's signs of blood clots, things like that, high fibrinogen levels, these are markers that are telling me that this patient 4:26 Speaker 2: is 4:27 Speaker 2: not very healthy 4:29 Speaker 2: and adding in hormones at this point might, it could actually fuel the fire. 4:34 Speaker 2: So I'm always going to kind of recommend looking at kind 4:38 Speaker 2: of a larger panel. It's a good base anyways because it allows the patient to know 4:43 Speaker 2: where they're at in their health, where they're at, where they headed. People kind of mean they haven't had blood work for 10 10 4:48 Speaker 2: years, man. And they have no idea. And they want to jump on testosterone because- They don't feel good. Because they want to feel good. They want to get erection or something like that, right? I mean, it's like, okay, back up a 2nd. Testosterone does so much more than that, by the way, and we'll talk about that, right, JD? But I think just doing things the right way, making sure that you're a candidate, which most people are, Most men are, especially hitting 40 right now. I'm seeing, you know, I'm 5:13 Speaker 2: seeing these levels are a bit on the floor, to the floor, and we know that physiologically, 5:18 Speaker 2: testosterone has so many benefits to the human body, right? It's not just about what we just, you know, rushed on. Obviously. So yeah, the obvious, you know, but there's so many deep, you know, benefits that I think that, you know, it's important. And when I say physiologically, 5:33 Speaker 2: it means like you wanna make sure you're doing it responsibly, 5:37 Speaker 2: Responsibly. 5:38 Speaker 2: Like a 5:38 Speaker 2: lot of guys come to me and they're like, they've been on it for 5 years. They've been doing 200, running 200 mg on sipponate for 5 years and their blood work's a disaster. It's like, woah, wait, let's back Let's 5:49 Speaker 2: sit on that for a 2nd because like disaster meaning what? Just lipid panels are off. Homocysteine is high, which is, you know, that's bad, right? We see inflammatory 5:58 Speaker 2: markers might be elevated. You might see high iron, 6:00 Speaker 2: which, know, having elevated iron is extremely inflammatory to the body, right? It's very inflammatory. 6:06 Speaker 2: So I just see like signs of oxidative stress inflammation 6:09 Speaker 2: when guys are running this for so long and they've never gotten checked. You know, there there there is a science behind it. And on top of that, this is the most important thing. There's things that you need to do when you're gonna be taking TRT. 6:22 Speaker 2: Because what happens is, you get these estrogenic effects. And then guess what happens? There's so many guys out there and women out there that do not, their bodies are not detoxifying very well. 6:34 Speaker 2: So you have 2 pathways. There's 6 pathways of detoxification 6:38 Speaker 2: through the liver. 2 of those are used to detoxify 6:42 Speaker 2: estrogen. 6:43 Speaker 2: It's a methylation 6:44 Speaker 2: pathway and a glucuronidation pathway. You gotta make sure that those are working well. So how do you do that? What affects them? What affects that from not working well? Just food? Lack of methylation. 6:55 Speaker 2: So foods and nutrients. 6:57 Speaker 2: Maybe they have poor gut 7:00 Speaker 2: health. Super common. Very, very common, right? So they're not detoxifying. They have something called elevated beta glucuronidase. 7:07 Speaker 2: That's an enzyme produced by gut bacteria 7:10 Speaker 2: that really, you need some of it, but when you have too much of it, you're gonna get your Estrogen is just gonna just build up in your tissues. This is why guys are getting acne. They're getting bitched tittin, AKA gynecomastia. 7:23 Speaker 2: Should have said it the other way. Gynecomastia, 7:25 Speaker 2: right? Women are getting breast cancers and cervical cancers. It's because they are not detoxifying estrogen very well. So you got to methylate. You got to take DIM. You got to take calcium glutarate. 7:36 Speaker 2: These are products that you want to take while you are on TRT. You want to take fish oil, bergamot, nattokinase 7:44 Speaker 2: to keep the blood thin, right? Because hematocrit goes up, you're going to produce more red blood cells when you're on testosterone, you're going to get that thickness of the blood. So you want to take things that naturally thin the blood, fish oil, turmeric, 7:55 Speaker 2: great things that just naturally thin out the blood. Drinking a lot of water, of course, right? So 8:01 Speaker 2: there's a science behind it. There's a beautiful way to do it so that you minimize 8:05 Speaker 2: the side effects of estrogen and DHT. Don't forget about DHT. 8:09 Speaker 1: Testosterone eventually converts to DHT. That's what harms the prostate. I think that's what causes many men are worried about that 1 in particular. I'm not gonna lose my hair. Well, it's possible, but like, like, like I wear hat all the time. I don't know. I'm kind of thin. Whatever. Yeah. I mean, but like, whatever, I'm Italian dude, but like, it's funny because 8:26 Speaker 1: that's what people think. But like, 8:29 Speaker 1: as you age, you start to lose your hair, but it does, it does, DHT is going affect your hair. 8:35 Speaker 1: The prostate. So do you want to have energy and sex drive and all these other things and then like worry about that could be affecting it or, like, you know what I mean? But there's ways to minimize that. There's ways to minimize the estrogenic effects and minimize the DHT effects. 8:47 Speaker 3: And that's through Without purely just taking finasteride and Yeah. I'm talking about just leaving that out. 8:54 Speaker 2: Doing it naturally, right? Naturally, you could do it 1 in a person naturally. And then it also depends on frequency of dosing. That's huge, right? How we dose our testosterone is huge 9:02 Speaker 2: in those 9:04 Speaker 2: spikes where the big spikes, you're going to get that aromatization of estrogen, which guess what? 9:09 Speaker 2: What happens if you're not detoxifying that? That's when you really become a disaster. 9:13 Speaker 2: Okay. You get those spikes, you're going to have more DHT conversion. That's when you're going to have prostate enlargement, where you're to have balding 9:20 Speaker 2: hair loss. 9:21 Speaker 1: I mean, dude, sitting on that and like, that's great. That's awesome. Like if you have, if you're been listening to this and you didn't know about how important blood work is, there it is my job. Like you have to stay ahead of the curve. Like you don't know what your body's doing. All these things affect each other. So I'm 9:40 Speaker 1: tired, so I get into testosterone. It's so much deeper than that dude. Like, and what I was curious about in the beginning when you started talking about how you're 9:48 Speaker 1: it's, is it the inflammation 9:50 Speaker 1: that tells you that, like if they are 9:53 Speaker 2: possibly going towards a heart attack or something like that, if you pull their blood work, is it you look at the inflammation? So you're not directly looking at inflammation. You're looking at markers that give you a sign that there is inflammation in the body. Right. You want to look at the LDL particle size and particle number. You want to look at the VLDL particle size and particle number. Homocysteine is huge in that. That's kind of 1 of the markers I look at right now that really I say, okay, homocysteine is elevated. You're not methylating. If you're not methylating, you're not detoxifying 10:19 Speaker 2: estrogen, right? So it's a good indicator for me to know like this patient needs a little bit of assistance, a little bit of help 1st. Sometimes there's genetic issues, know, the MTHFR gene, we all kind of have probably heard about that, right? Where we have a defect in being able to methylate. Well, you gotta find that out. Sometimes people have that issue, so you need to address that and that needs to be addressed 1st before you're gonna be going into any type of a program. Detoxifying 10:45 Speaker 3: would fasting count as that? Would that be something you ask somebody to do? Sure. Yeah. Fasting is great for detoxification. 10:51 Speaker 2: Detoxifying your liver. What about donating blood? I think that donating blood every 6 months is a great rule of thumb. I just had a patient just ask me just an hour ago. 11:00 Speaker 2: Hey, he showed me a blood bank. He goes, how often you know, he's on TRT. How often should I be doing that? I guess every 6 months. Yeah. You know, just to try to keep that, you know, the blood on I donated blood to the Red Cross. A, it's a good thing because they need blood. Yeah. For sure. B, 11:12 Speaker 3: well, 1st of all, they do ask you, maybe I shouldn't have been to this on camera, but like, I'm taking Tesofro and they ask you if you're taking that stuff because they don't really want your blood. Although 11:21 Speaker 3: I still donated and thinking, well, shit, I hope they can use it. And they've like bugged me. They keep calling me back and I'll still go donate a bit every 6 months. But they're like, yeah, great. Your blood is awesome. We want more of it. Oh, cool. Was Sometimes I don't think that that was gonna happen. I thought they gonna 11:36 Speaker 3: throw this away. Because not every man does it. I don't do that nearly as much as 6 months. Because it's cool. Like we are men are a closed system, right? And as far as blood goes, right? So we just circulate the same blood. 11:48 Speaker 3: Women closed have system, women 11:50 Speaker 3: get rid their blood. They basically naturally bloodlet. That's 11:54 Speaker 3: good. You know, from ancient 11:57 Speaker 3: times, they thought that 11:59 Speaker 3: bloodletting was, and they actually were kind of onto something, although they did that for everything. 12:04 Speaker 3: Any sickness like, well, no, let's just cut them and let's and let's cut them bleed them out and maybe in the butt. I mean, it's because your body makes new blood and 12:12 Speaker 1: that's new clean blood. Yeah. So that is 1 thing. So that's good to know that it's Yeah, I think it's a good rule of thumb to do that. Like you said, you just nailed it. It's good for it's a win win situation. Yeah. Right. Right. It's not a bad thing. Not a bad thing. Well, like comparable to what you just said, and 1 of the things I'll tell you with Scott going through my blood work, and I know how deep he goes and know how it took, what do we talk when we last time a blood work hour and 0.5? I'm like, oh dude, I got it. I got it. But like you go deep, but comparable to the degree 12:39 Speaker 1: where 12:40 Speaker 1: comparable to the degree where like a typical medical doctor, you go, some dude goes in to get his blood work done by just a typical medical doctor compared to the panel that you run, which is a lot deeper. 12:52 Speaker 3: What's the difference? Cause they run a very small, most will run a very small blood panel. Is that enough? Most doctors are running? Like not even close, right? No, no. It doesn't give you a picture of what's going on with someone's true health. You know, close. You know offhand off the top of your head or notes? Like what panels do you run? I know it's a long list of check marks. Do you know all of the panels that you actually run when you have the patient to run Blend? 13:18 Speaker 2: Can you recite them? Okay, no. There's so many different panels. 13:22 Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, they're not all blood, 13:24 Speaker 2: right? Some of them are genetic panels, some of them are stool tests, some of them are urine panels, depending on what the patient really needs. So there's so many tools 13:32 Speaker 2: in the box, you know, for really getting a good analysis on a patient's health. You know, there's organic acids, you know, people wanting to kind of look more towards the mitochondrial side, right? Like, you know, you could do an organics acid test. I mean, there's just so many different tests to run to kind of see where you're at in that whole 13:49 Speaker 3: physiological system in your body. Right? Good. I just have a friend, like I have a friend who's got insurance and he's like, alright, I'm gonna go get my blood blood tested. And he goes to his doctor 13:58 Speaker 3: and he doesn't really know what he's doing. Like, doc, I wanna get my, like, my I wanna get my testosterone checked. Doctor's like, oh, okay, cool. And just marks off the 1 panel. Yeah. Right? Does the No free testosterone. Right? And, yeah, no free And literally blows 14:11 Speaker 3: his, you know, 1 blood test a year covered by insurance, right, for a total testosterone. Calls him back. He's like, go ahead. Got your total testosterone. There it is. And it's 2 50, and he says it away because Yeah. Was like, no. You're away. It's just 39. 14:24 Speaker 1: You're good. You're totally normal, bro. Didn't 14:27 Speaker 1: run any other tests. Yeah. Nothing. Like I'll ask people because when I was doing the fitness stuff and like having blood work ran, mean, I don't know where near like your knowledge obviously, but like I will, I can't even tell you how many doctors 14:40 Speaker 1: run the testosterone without even pretestosterone estrogen. Like bro, geez. Oh 14:46 Speaker 1: my God. What's your free testosterone? It doesn't say like, Oh my gosh, dude. 14:50 Speaker 1: They're like, no offense, but like, you wonder why I have a problem with some of the doctors. Come on dude. Some guys take like finasteride. 14:56 Speaker 2: So what that does is it 14:59 Speaker 2: shunts DHT so that you're pushing up your total testosterone. 15:03 Speaker 2: There's guys who got 1000 testosterone 15:05 Speaker 2: who are in their 60s and think they're champs because they're on finasteride. And 15:10 Speaker 2: if you run 15:11 Speaker 2: there free, it's like 2 or 3, you know what I mean? It's like to the floor. 15:15 Speaker 1: Yeah. Well, so if we use that and we're looking at that, so what, you know, Will and I will get this allowed, just friends that we talk to and because, you know, because of what we do and, 15:24 Speaker 1: you have people that don't want to take testosterone. And Will and I are always like, Take the testosterone. 15:30 Speaker 1: Like, listen, each is on them. We're both fans of like, live and let live. So you get someone that doesn't want to take testosterone. What's 15:38 Speaker 1: your protocol? Do you agree with some of the protocols? 15:41 Speaker 1: And if somebody doesn't want to take testosterone, how do you approach that? Because we all here know how 15:48 Speaker 1: amazing and especially for anybody 40, but anybody with these types of levels that are coming back, 15:53 Speaker 1: do you recommend other 15:55 Speaker 1: protocols that are not actual hormones? 15:58 Speaker 2: No. 15:59 Speaker 1: You'll 16:00 Speaker 3: talk to them out of it. Because what's the If they don't want to run it, don't want take it. If their testosterone is really low and obvious and they are hurting, displaying all the signs that they're like, I will not take testosterone. Clomiphene. Do you try to say, okay, fine, let's take Oh, and clomiphene. Take in clomiphene. Yeah, that's what I mean. Clomiphene. Yeah, 16:19 Speaker 2: Definitely. Yeah. That's always another option. I don't think it's nearly. No, 16:23 Speaker 2: man. I mean, and then- Why not just take this other thing? Well, let's all talk about this too is, know, lot of them will say, well, I'm gonna go get the 16:30 Speaker 1: The cream. The cream. Or gel. Right? Yeah. Dude, I've never seen anybody happy. Have you? No. No one's happy with the creams. Know, man, you gotta you gotta get the injection if you ask me. That it's just it's a game changer, right, as we know. So- Yep. Well, let's, okay, so blood work, that would be another time. We'll come to where we can do a little deeper because, I mean, we can talk about blood work forever. I'm super into it. That's so intriguing. 16:51 Speaker 1: We came here to talk about some of our favorite subject was going be testosterone replacement. So I 16:57 Speaker 1: feel like I know quite a bit, but I'm with 2 dudes that know a lot more, even than me about like Esters and things like that. So let's break down the Esters because Will and I have never really even tapped on that. When we were kind of thinking of what we wanted to talk with you, but let's dig into some of the Esther's dude and what they do and why they're different and why different men like them and blah, blah, blah. I mean, let's kind of dig into how many there are, why they're different, why certain men should take them and kind of go start from there. Do think? Let me answer that question, but I do want to make sure that we ask you, 17:27 Speaker 3: just give everybody kind of the long list of all of the benefits that testosterone provides you. Maybe, 17:32 Speaker 3: I mean, if you want to do that now before we get into it, just as a more like basics- I have a cheat sheet here. Okay. Because there's so many- Where do I start? 17:40 Speaker 3: Tell the people why, what testosterone does. If you're at home Why, why, why somebody wants to take it? What are the good things? And some bad things. Let's let's be even. So let's let's talk about that. Yeah. So, you know, you know, most men 17:52 Speaker 2: and even women, women 17:54 Speaker 2: will be for libido. Men, it's gonna be for libido. It's gonna be for erection purposes and motivation and energy. That's kind of why people get their Right? Attention for 18:03 Speaker 2: So I always like to say, well, you know, 18:05 Speaker 2: when you get that physiological 18:07 Speaker 2: balance, it's not just that. It's also about brain, 18:10 Speaker 2: heart, 18:11 Speaker 3: bone, 18:12 Speaker 2: gut, neurological health. Nobody really had thought, what? I didn't know that. So here, so just to check it out. Let's go. Improves focus, concentration, working memory, enhances verbal memory and spatial ability, 18:23 Speaker 2: may slow age related cognitive 18:28 Speaker 2: decline, 18:28 Speaker 2: reduces depression and anxiety symptoms, improves motivation, drive confidence, 18:32 Speaker 2: reduces fatigue and brain fog, supports neuroplasticity, 18:36 Speaker 2: may reduce the risk of Alzheimer's and neurodegenerative 18:39 Speaker 2: diseases, enhances dopamine signaling, improves sleep quality, better blood vessel dilation, coronary blood flow, exercise 18:47 Speaker 2: tolerance, 18:48 Speaker 2: cardiac output decreases insulin resistance, decreases visceral fat, increases lean muscle mass, leads to reduced cardio metabolic risk, 18:56 Speaker 2: decrease. That's a big 1, right? Because all you hear is, oh, it can cause heart attacks. That was the opposite. Decreases triglycerides, 19:02 Speaker 2: modest decrease in total cholesterol may slightly decrease HDL, 19:06 Speaker 2: but it also decreases CRP, 19:09 Speaker 2: tumor necrosis, 19:11 Speaker 2: alpha, and interleukin-six, 19:12 Speaker 2: which are inflammatory. 19:14 Speaker 2: We call those inflammatory cytokines in the body that push inflammation. 19:18 Speaker 2: Wow. Listen to this 1. Improves 19:20 Speaker 2: intestinal mobility. 19:22 Speaker 2: Great for IBS. People who have gut issues, 19:25 Speaker 2: constipation and gastroparesis. 19:28 Speaker 2: That's where your body stops moving things through the gut. 19:32 Speaker 2: Increases microbial 19:33 Speaker 2: diversity. That's the microbiome. It increases the gut microbes. You want a lot of diversity in the gut. You want a lot of different bacteria 19:40 Speaker 2: in the gut. Those are your probiotics. 19:43 Speaker 2: Improves beneficial bacterial populations, 19:46 Speaker 2: reduces gut inflammation. 19:47 Speaker 2: Here's a big 1. Enhances the tight junctions of the gut. So, we've all, you know, people are hearing about leaky gut gut permeability. 19:54 Speaker 2: It helps to kind of maintain 19:57 Speaker 2: the lumen of the gut. And that's important because that lumen gets open and that's when you start having problems with systemic issues and things like that. I'm almost done here. Reduces 20:07 Speaker 2: excessive gut immune activation 20:09 Speaker 2: increases here we go for bone increases osteoblast 20:12 Speaker 2: activity that increases bone density, improves bone mineral density, reduces fracture risk. 20:17 Speaker 2: We're almost there. Hang in there. Prevents osteoporosis, 20:22 Speaker 2: improves strength and functional capacity, reduces sarcopenia, 20:26 Speaker 2: that is muscle wasting. When you have diseases like cancers, 20:29 Speaker 2: AIDS Ultra 20:31 Speaker 0: running shoes are all about space. 20:34 Speaker 0: The space to go further, 20:35 Speaker 0: to feel better, to do something you never thought possible. And this space 20:40 Speaker 0: starts with UltraFit. 20:42 Speaker 0: Unlike traditional running shoes, UltraFit gives toes more room to move naturally. So every step is strong, 20:48 Speaker 0: balanced, balanced, and comfortable. Whatever you're lacing up for, stay out there with Ultra. Shop now at ultrarunning.com. 20:56 Speaker 0: That's altrarunning.com. 21:00 Speaker 2: Aging. Alright? Men, as we age, we start to lose our triceps. We start to lose our butt, right? That's called sarcopenia. 21:06 Speaker 2: It reduces that ability to, you know, to have that happen, right? Improves collagen synthesis, 21:11 Speaker 2: enhances joint integrity and repair, 21:13 Speaker 2: reduces chronic musculoskeletal 21:15 Speaker 2: pain, 21:16 Speaker 2: and then reduces A1C. We know HbA1c can go down, increases mitochondrial 21:21 Speaker 2: function. Mitochondria, 21:23 Speaker 2: right? Improves thyroid hormone conversion. 21:26 Speaker 2: That means like your thyroid produces T4, needs to be converted to T3 21:30 Speaker 2: to make that thyroid hormone available to do what it does for cells. 21:35 Speaker 2: I mean, come on. Well, 21:37 Speaker 1: I mean, so as you were reading that, I don't know what you were thinking about, but like, if you're sitting at home, 21:44 Speaker 1: guys 21:45 Speaker 1: and you're not on testosterone and you're over 40 21:48 Speaker 1: or whatever, your testosterone is where a lot of they are, even 30 year olds are under 300 and you aren't running to the doctor right now. What are you doing? Look at, listen to that. Like it's not just to 21:59 Speaker 1: increase sex drive. He'll on and on. He just read a list that like took like 5 minutes. So 22:07 Speaker 3: don't like, so here's the thing. No, no, I'm just saying like, that's awesome. That's awesome. What I was thinking is I don't like the news because I don't believe anybody who just tells me 1 side is all awesome and the other side is just terrible. Right? And this is what the news. So 22:20 Speaker 3: tell us, so be, so, so what are the biggest, in your opinion, what are the biggest problems with testosterone? What 22:27 Speaker 3: are the biggest problems that you can see resulting from people taking testosterone? That's 22:32 Speaker 2: the best question because it doesn't have to be a problem at all. 22:37 Speaker 2: 0 problem if you do it correctly. Right? I think, like I said, the biggest problem I'm seeing is 22:42 Speaker 2: the injection frequency might be just once a week. So you're flooding the estrogen, 22:48 Speaker 2: getting the DHT. 22:49 Speaker 2: The 22:50 Speaker 2: next problem is not knowing how much you really need. Remember, I get it. There's guys that want to bulk up. 22:59 Speaker 2: Cycle it then, man. Mean, like go up and then bring it back down because if you- Cruise blast. I I see you got the guys coming in at $202.50, 23:07 Speaker 2: 300 for 23:08 Speaker 2: they've been on it for a long time. I got guys who've been running that for- Well, let me let's stop there for a 2nd. That's interesting. So that 23:14 Speaker 1: where is the cutoff for like a TRT dose? Because we will and I kind of like, I'm gonna offer an opinion on that and it's somewhat of an opinion, but let's answer that. Where, what would you say would be a cutoff between 23:26 Speaker 1: a TRT dose? Because it's gonna obviously what your levels are, but like where it blends over into a a a like a steroid cycle. Because so so it's gonna be different for for for everybody. Sure. Sure. Sure. You know what mean? And there's so many factors that play in in that role. It's And let's take those out though. Let's take those out as it converts to estrogen and all the negatives that could be, but would you say there would be like a threshold if you had to answer that? A better way to answer that, ask that is, if you had to answer that, where would be that general 23:55 Speaker 1: marker 400? 23:57 Speaker 3: I always thinking- you had a gun to your head, 24:00 Speaker 3: what would be the average TRT? Attributes, 24:06 Speaker 1: like I would say 2 24:07 Speaker 1: 50, you would have said- I'd say 2 50 24:12 Speaker 3: is about the max TRT dose. 24:14 Speaker 3: Think the anabolic threshold 24:17 Speaker 3: is about 400. So about 400 mg, 24:20 Speaker 3: where you're popping muscles out. That is like highly increasing your 24:24 Speaker 1: protein synthesis. I'm not running anything, dude. 24:27 Speaker 2: It's much, much lower than that. Really? Okay. All right, let's go. Okay. So, I mean, and again, remember I'm running the blood work. I'm seeing I'm doing the data here, right? I see the data. So I'll see guys that are running about 150 mg a week. And that seems to be kind of like, I feel like that seems to be for this. 24:45 Speaker 2: Physiologically healthy. Yeah. 24:47 Speaker 2: About 125 to 150 mg per week seems to be that sweet spot for health. What I'm seeing on that, I'm seeing a total testosterone anywhere from 700 to 1,000 on that, just to let you know. Right? That's good. And then I'm seeing a free right around 25 to maybe 40 in that right there. So when I start seeing guys coming in at 202 50 and they're staying on that for a long period of time, I'm already seeing problems. They've been running that for a year, 10 What problems? As far as blood work goes. Yeah, like what? Like what we discussed. I'm seeing elevations in the lipids, the particle size, the particle numbers of homocysteine. 25:21 Speaker 2: I'm seeing elevations in ferritin. I'm seeing iron levels come up. Iron, very toxic, right? Seeing ferritin, total iron percent saturation. We're seeing these 25:30 Speaker 2: levels that are rising on these blood 25:33 Speaker 2: reports that are telling me red flag, man. Gotta, if you want to run that for a while, you'll give it 8 weeks, bring it back down though. 25:43 Speaker 1: So, and then So when would you generally start like a typical person that like, obviously you run their blood work, what would you generally start them on 150 then? Yeah, about 100 Most doctors start at 200 banks. Yeah. I started 150. I say 150 and then I run it after 6 weeks. So, yeah, when's the next check-in? So, you know, you tell people, hey, we're going to start this. Don't expect 26:02 Speaker 3: a change or to feel better. What do you tell people when did they should expect to maybe feel something 26:07 Speaker 2: from that? I weeks. 3 say 26:09 Speaker 2: to 4 weeks. And then at 6 weeks, run it. If you gotta tweak it, you you tweak it then, right? And then I'll run it at 3 months. Then from Yeah, 90 days. And then every 6 months. That 26:20 Speaker 1: seems to be a good Well, 1 of the things that Will and I talk about so frequently is 26:25 Speaker 1: sweet spots where we're all science project. We're all very different because some dude at the gym told you that you should run 200 megs. 26:31 Speaker 1: You're very different than due to the gym. So like you have to toy around with different markers or different amounts, which we both have, which I know you have. And that takes time, because you have to let try it for, like you just said, maybe 90 days to see how your body does at 150. I do. Like me, for me, it's too much. 26:50 Speaker 1: It took me a long time because I convert to extra quickly. 26:54 Speaker 1: And so 200 is literally, I go 26:56 Speaker 1: over 200, I'm telling you, I know I'm under over 200 because I 27:00 Speaker 1: could feel it. But that comes with only like experience 27:03 Speaker 1: and time and trying different things. 27:06 Speaker 2: Like I said, it's a 1 size fits all. So I always start 27:10 Speaker 2: cautiously, 27:11 Speaker 2: you know, start low. And there are some people that need to bump that up more. There's 27:14 Speaker 2: some people at 150, they're like, wow, it's a little bit much. It's pretty rare to see that. But I have had some instances where it's been a little too much and they have to dub it. But more people, 150 seems like they're pretty happy. They're getting the response. The blood work looks good. And again, if they're going to start bumping it up more, we talked about the supplementation, how important that is because 27:34 Speaker 2: there is going to be adverse effects when you get it there and keep it going for such a long time. So they go through those really quickly again because now that's such a perfect Yeah. 27:45 Speaker 2: So methylation support, all that is, it's simple. It's B6, 27:48 Speaker 2: B12, and methylfolate. 27:50 Speaker 2: Okay. 27:51 Speaker 2: Have a product that I use that's 27:53 Speaker 2: a DIM product mixed with calcium glutarate. 27:57 Speaker 2: We talked about beta glucuronidase 27:59 Speaker 2: activity being a problem. 28:00 Speaker 2: DIM actually what it does is it actually takes estrogen gets broken down into 4 metabolites. 28:05 Speaker 2: 2 of them are very toxic. 2 of them are healthy, right? What DIM does, it kind of scoots those 28:11 Speaker 2: metabolites to the healthier ones and brings it to the ability to detoxify 28:16 Speaker 2: it. And then you get the calcium, 28:19 Speaker 2: glucarate and the methylation support to grab it and detoxify it. Okay. Yep. See, so then you got that, right? Those are 2 products, right? A dim product and a methylator. 28:28 Speaker 2: I think being on good fatty acids, fish oil is always important because it does help to keep the blood thin. Right? It's good. It's super healthy. You get a lot of health benefits for omega-three fatty acids. 28:38 Speaker 2: You want to be on, I like nattokinase because what it does, nattokinase 28:43 Speaker 2: helps with clotting. It keeps the blood clots down. So 28:47 Speaker 2: you got that. Pergamot, 28:49 Speaker 2: great for the particle size and the particle number of LDL. 28:52 Speaker 2: We know that the particles 28:55 Speaker 2: of LDL is what clogs our arteries. 28:58 Speaker 2: Backing up 1 more thing, homocysteine levels. The easiest way to bring that down is with a methylator. That's it. B6, B12, methylfolate takes that homocysteine and brings it down. But it's homocysteine, what it does is it's a free radical. 29:10 Speaker 2: Everybody has it. It's from the breakdown of protein. We 29:14 Speaker 2: have to detoxify it. A lot of it gets circulated into the bloodstream. And what it does is it 29:19 Speaker 2: wreaks havoc on the inside of the arteries. 29:21 Speaker 2: It scars up the arteries so that if you have high triglycerides, 29:25 Speaker 2: high LDL particles, then you just and high inflammation. It's a disaster for arterial sclerosis. 29:31 Speaker 2: You get it? It's also an Alzheimer's marker, by the way. Gauging that as like, okay, if you got high homocysteine, 29:36 Speaker 2: you could be heading down the path for Alzheimer's 1 day too. 29:40 Speaker 2: Yeah, again, so we got fish oil, we got 29:43 Speaker 2: methylation support, we got a good, dim product, 29:47 Speaker 2: nattokinase, 29:48 Speaker 2: and then like an anti inflammatory, 29:51 Speaker 2: either bergamot, I like bergamot, turmeric, resveratrol, 29:54 Speaker 2: something like that thrown in there. Also, 29:57 Speaker 1: support is always good. Not trying to do too many supplements here, but- Well, you're talking about supplements too, but like, let's talk a little bit about like the point of this podcast, which is the peptides. Like what that's, they're huge on inflammation. So what would you say running those as well, like a thymosin Alpha-one, which is the best for inflammation. 30:13 Speaker 1: You add that step in? 30:14 Speaker 2: Definitely. And if a patient's down to do peptides, that's whole nother ballgame, right? You want to start adding in some of those peptides. Some people can't afford peptides. Testosterone 30:22 Speaker 2: is cheap. I want to do this and I want to start there. Hey, if you can get them into the peptide game, I mean, God, talk about health benefits or that's a whole other, that's a whole game changer, right? As we know, on the health side, seeing blood work change. Mean, there's so many- Champagne in the whole world. Oh man, 30:37 Speaker 2: Let 30:38 Speaker 1: me talk about this stuff for you have like, let's say as men get older, 1 of the things that's super common is from a lot of men is prostate cancer or something like that. If you have an older guy that says he has some markers that are leading to that or like has beginning stages of that, what would you do with that? Like he's got super low testosterone, 30:57 Speaker 1: you know, and like he wants to fix that, but what would you do with a case like that? I think that, you know, testosterone 31:02 Speaker 2: therapy, I think it 31:04 Speaker 2: depends. 1st of all, you gotta see how severe is this? You know what I mean? What is that PSA? What is the percent PSA? Has he been tested? Does he have cancer yet? Remember, 31:14 Speaker 2: it's inevitable. If a man doesn't die of anything, he'll eventually die of prostate cancer. 31:18 Speaker 2: So I think that like, 1st of all, seeing, being responsible to know how severe is this condition. Number 2, if you're going to do it, 31:26 Speaker 2: it needs to be done correctly, right? As far as how you frequently 31:30 Speaker 2: you dose that. The dose DGG, 31:33 Speaker 2: mean, God, if you can do it 31:35 Speaker 1: daily, that's 31:36 Speaker 2: the best way to do it. You can do it with this 1. And not only that, better yet, SubQ. 31:40 Speaker 2: SubQ 31:41 Speaker 2: is the best way to take testosterone. A 31:46 Speaker 2: lot of work. Exactly. 31:47 Speaker 2: It is. And you put that oil on your tummy. But it is the best, safest way to do it is and to do it every day. I 31:54 Speaker 1: don't know many people that do want for a little bit. Like, dude, screw this. It's just a lot of oil in the state. Yeah, but it comes down to somebody like him who's 32:01 Speaker 2: at the verge of, you know, 32:03 Speaker 1: let's 32:06 Speaker 1: segue with that being said into the S-3s because that's a good segue into it because the S-3s are going to affect how 32:13 Speaker 1: often you need to do it and then whatnot. So, you know, I know that we were kind of tapping on this a little bit before recording, but in The United States, Tessep is like probably the most common or test e, 32:24 Speaker 1: but right? In other countries, 32:27 Speaker 3: SIP, but Test e in other countries. Other countries. Yeah. 32:30 Speaker 1: Other countries. But let's talk about it. Whoever wants to start, because you both know a lot about the Esters. Will, why don't you drop some Esters stuff? So 32:37 Speaker 1: what 32:38 Speaker 3: testosterone and why the esters? Okay, so 1st of all, here's a big misconception. Testosterone is testosterone. It's all the same drug. I don't care what 32:46 Speaker 3: testosterone you get, they come in different esters, right? Propionate, 32:51 Speaker 3: siponate, 32:51 Speaker 3: enanthate, isocaproide, 32:53 Speaker 3: decanoate. 32:55 Speaker 3: All that is, is the testosterone, 32:57 Speaker 3: the 32:58 Speaker 3: drug does the same thing to you folks. It's just like a fast release or a delay release pill. 33:04 Speaker 3: Testosterone is wrapped in the ester and it determines how fast or slow it gets released into your body, 33:10 Speaker 3: into your bloodstream. Tests, 33:12 Speaker 3: well, there's suspension, 33:13 Speaker 3: which is just test 33:15 Speaker 3: suspended in water. About 33:17 Speaker 1: 2 hour 0.5 life, Right? We got like an active 0.5 life. Right? Never seen it. Sounds It hurts like hell. So as a general rule checked every 2 hours. And you gotta do it every 2 hours. Yes. So wouldn't that be good though if you're gonna take it before you left? I mean, that sounds amazing. Absolutely. You know I mean? Like you want to get a quick pump and you want to go lift heavy leg day. That would be cool. That's the thing. That's the 33:40 Speaker 3: Back in the eighties, nineties, I remember people would do that. They would inject that right before their workout. You know? Absolutely. That sounds like logical. Another thing like bodybuilders, right, who will they'll do as they're bulking bulking. Right? They're doing long esters because it compounds on itself and their testosterone is gonna be high as they get closer to the competition. And regardless, testosterone's gonna cause a little bit of water retention and they wanna look as lean as possible. So they go, they switch down as it gets closer to fast esters. 34:06 Speaker 3: So then they're able to so it's not lingering around. And then about 5 days pre comp, they just pull everything. Yeah. 34:12 Speaker 3: But 34:13 Speaker 3: it would be that there is a good use for it. 34:16 Speaker 3: It's day before, right? Those days lead to it. So you got the fastest. But basically the fastest suspension, 34:23 Speaker 3: there is an acetate, ester, and propionate. 34:26 Speaker 3: Testosterone, 34:27 Speaker 3: I've seen it in acetate, but those are really fast esters. 34:31 Speaker 3: Those are maybe 20, 24 hours. Right? But 34:34 Speaker 3: as far as the 0.5 life goes? Propionate is 1 to 2 days. Okay. All right. So you're gonna it's an it's 34:40 Speaker 3: but that's its 0.5 life, but it's kind of act its activity in you Sure. Is probably yeah. So you wanna check that every other 48 hours. You wanna check every other day, if not every day. Sometimes every day. If not every day. If you can't, like, that would be ideal. Right? If you could, every day would be ideal. Definitely. And there's different that balance. Different research on the sipionate and anathate, but my Same shit. She's like 35:01 Speaker 3: People are so weird about it. Is like, I don't know, 6, 7 days. The other 1 is It's a day off. Is 7 days. So sipionate is, like, 6 days. And it's 8 7. Let's repeat that part. Let's repeat that part because, like, most people It's 5 to 7. It's 5. Scipione is 6 to 8. 35:15 Speaker 2: 0, you think Scipione is a little longer? A little longer, Esther. Just a little longer. Yeah. Very but they're so interchangeable. So 35:22 Speaker 3: people feel like I gotta do my sipionate. 35:25 Speaker 1: No difference. 35:26 Speaker 2: There's does really matter. You know, I'll tell you what though, you know, being in the bodybuilding realm for a long time, especially when I was back in my twenties, 35:34 Speaker 2: you always had people who preferred 1 or the other. I'll 35:37 Speaker 2: tell you what, sympionate seems to win, doesn't it? Always. People always say, I've always heard, oh, I feel a little bit more oomph off of that. And this is more for the bodybuilding side, you guys. This is not for the physiological tier 2. This is more the bodybuilding side when people would feel like, I just feel Jim Rats would feel that way. Yeah. Oh, I feel a little more oomph off the Sip and the Ante Ath Basil. Really? I don't think so. I mean, I have heard the other way. I've 35:58 Speaker 3: heard the other way, and I thought, and I feel the other way. Think that's a bit better. But 36:03 Speaker 3: basically, Hey, why do doctors use SIP today? Because it's easiest to give to patients, right? We'll have more patients if we can give them an ester and a lot of people don't react very poorly, right? Their muscles tolerate it very well. And you have to, but you have to inject it less. But frankly, 36:21 Speaker 3: still, even if you have a long ester, you can still inject that daily and that is a better way to do it. You 36:26 Speaker 2: don't get these big spikes and guess what? Every hormone is predicated on another hormone, right? He said 6 spikes earlier, I want to brush up on. When you talked about medical doctors prescribing it at 200 mg, Okay, 36:37 Speaker 2: but you know what? 36:39 Speaker 2: That's once every 14 days. They're telling these people, these medical doctors, we're going to give you 200 mg and we're injecting it once every 2 weeks, 36:47 Speaker 2: which is not good. I'm getting like 2 a 36:51 Speaker 2: week. From 36:52 Speaker 2: MDs. I 36:53 Speaker 1: mean, that's what I've ran into a lot. 200 36:56 Speaker 1: megs week with an AI. 36:58 Speaker 1: And they suggest you take it. Don't even ask about it, but that's what they just, they prescribe 37:02 Speaker 1: to, I mean, not every doctor, I'm not, I can't categorize them all, but I'm saying the guys that I've spoken to, which they're doing the fitness stuff, a lot of them are 200 megs with an AI and the doctor put them on that. 37:14 Speaker 2: So I'm not saying right or wrong, just saying that's what Maybe they talk about AIs too because those are horrible for- Yeah. Thymin is the same thing with vitamin E. It's an AI. You don't need 37:22 Speaker 3: you don't need AIs too much. You're taking a whole lot of drugs. And 37:26 Speaker 2: you're detoxifying. 37:27 Speaker 3: Yeah. And 37:29 Speaker 3: when I say, tell people, Hey, take AI. I mean, it's because you're having experiencing gynecomastia. 37:34 Speaker 1: Totally. 37:35 Speaker 1: Or like that. 37:36 Speaker 3: You want to take as little as possible. Right? But I say, hey, you gotta get rid of those side effects, especially gyno. That's permanent. If it Yeah. You're true. If it will grow, you're done. You wanna take that till the side effects are gone, then we slowly pull the AI out and take as little as possible. And there comes a point like JD is like, he's 1 where it doesn't matter, the AIs. You just need to lower your testosterone. Like, you can't back. I can't. Some people, you reach that point where 38:01 Speaker 3: the AIs in the world and, yeah, AIs are terrible taken at a lot for a long period of time. There's a lot of 38:08 Speaker 3: things that happen to you. Okay, back to esters. So personally, 38:12 Speaker 3: sustenance is my favorite 1. It's not an ester. Break it down though. What's a sustenance? It's 38:18 Speaker 3: a blend of 4 different esters, right? Sustenon comes from sustained release, right? That's why they named it Sustenon, but 38:25 Speaker 3: test prop, 38:27 Speaker 3: it's got phenyl prop. So sorry, didn't say that 1. Longer, 3, 38:31 Speaker 3: 4 days. So test prop hits you 24, 48 hours, Phenoprop, 38:36 Speaker 3: 3 to 4, 3 to 4 days. 38:38 Speaker 3: Then it's got isocaproate. 38:40 Speaker 3: Yeah, a little bit longer. A little bit longer. And that's like what, 7 to 4 to 5 days. Oh, you'll have 4 to 10. Okay. And then what's last 1? Decanoate or undecanoate? Which 38:49 Speaker 2: is Super long. 3 weeks, months. 3 weeks. Is that really 3 weeks? Yeah. I don't know what's You inject that like once every 2, 3 months. But you do a lot of it, man, like 3 cc's at once and it's just like, and then it holds you over, but that's dangerous. If 39:04 Speaker 2: you convert estrogen, that's not a 1. That's a good idea. You're gonna, then you can have clots from that. I mean, the oil and all that stuff. I've seen a test 500 that does, that's, 39:12 Speaker 3: was test e, test e, test sip, test 39:16 Speaker 3: undecanoate 39:17 Speaker 3: and decanoate, right? Like, 39:19 Speaker 3: cool. That is gonna result in 39:22 Speaker 3: way higher blood testosterone 39:23 Speaker 3: levels over time, but it's also gonna result in way higher estrogen levels because it's just compounding it. And then once you have the estrogen, you're like, damn, estrogens, there's no stopping it. Sorry folks, like If you got to let that stuff burn out of you for a 39:37 Speaker 3: you can get it out. Yeah, if you can get it out of you. So the safer way, if you are prone to side effects, fast esters is the way to go. Sure. Because if you happen to have, shit, I got this bad side effect, well, guess what? It'll be gone in 2 days. Yeah. If you just chill, 39:50 Speaker 3: which is why, 39:51 Speaker 2: I don't know, I'm a proponent of fast ester. Must be a great blend for you guys to put together would be a pro enanthate 39:57 Speaker 2: blend. 39:58 Speaker 3: Yeah. Which is kind of what I'm aiming for with my sustenance on, but then here's the reason I like sustenance. That's just from a feel. I'm not saying from a health perspective, but because 40:07 Speaker 3: and I do it frequently every other day 40:10 Speaker 3: at minimum, but you kind of feel a little kick because you, you know, you got the prop right now. You 40:16 Speaker 3: get a little kick and then kind of a backup 40:18 Speaker 3: kick the next day. And also you get the benefit of the long esters that do kind of compound and keep your levels high. People that love success, love it. Yeah. I 40:28 Speaker 3: just like it. I don't really like to do it 40:30 Speaker 3: as a sustain as my TRT though. Like if I'm going do like a cruise and blast, 40:35 Speaker 3: yes, that's what I'm a blast with. Then I'll just cruise with a cruise. Okay. So you got Sussan on it. I guess as a rule of thumb, we don't ever want to take an Ester like you want to do these prop ones. You don't ever want to let an Ester in you and out of you completely and then have nothing. Right? Which is why you want do the problem 3 days a week at least. So you see your little graph as up 40:54 Speaker 2: And before it gets out of you, we're doing it again. Bump it up again. Yeah. You have the gums. Bumps, though. Not Yeah. Yeah. So you 41:01 Speaker 0: Ultra running shoes are all about space. The space to go further, 41:05 Speaker 0: to feel better, to do something you never thought possible. 41:09 Speaker 0: And this space starts with Ultra Fit. Unlike traditional running shoes, Ultra Fit gives toes more room to move naturally, so every step is strong, 41:19 Speaker 0: balanced, 41:19 Speaker 0: and comfortable. Whatever you're lacing up for, stay out there with Ultra. 41:24 Speaker 0: Shop now at ultrarunning.com. 41:26 Speaker 0: That's altrarunning.com. 41:30 Speaker 1: We don't wanna do this. We wanna do this. Keeps it as even as possible. Sure. It's funny because you have so many people that just don't know about this stuff, and it's not a knock on them and it takes stuff to learn this stuff. But like they will start taking TRT and then they just stop. It's like, and they don't know why they feel like shit. Because like, dude, listen, you ate, you didn't, doctor didn't give you anything to stop. Like when he's like, no, I just like, yeah, that's not good. Do you want to add anything on the esters? Yeah, is that No, I think you nailed it. Because I want to see, so, so, so that's great. So everybody kind of has a preference. Like I would say the most popular 42:03 Speaker 1: in The United States is the SIP. People are like, I gotta have my sip, but if there's not sip, there's like, you know what I mean? I can't do just eat like it's the same thing, dude, but like they are like, you take out 0.5 that SIP, I fucking did. Like you put whatever, you know what I mean? So 42:16 Speaker 1: let's break down. That was great. Great way to break that on. Now, which 42:20 Speaker 1: person is in your guys' opinions 42:23 Speaker 1: should run each. Now, if you convert to estrogen like me, propionate would be best. Yeah. But 42:29 Speaker 1: that's not the most common. So like, what would you say? Who would fit 42:33 Speaker 1: the mold of some of those? Give me some examples of what man 42:37 Speaker 1: would use those. Like he likes Sussanon. It's very common. People like Sussanon, Sussanon. I'd never really liked Sussanon, but, 42:44 Speaker 1: again, it's kind of a matter of opinion. If you cannot handle injecting, 42:49 Speaker 3: do a long Ester. 42:52 Speaker 2: There's 1. Can't inject me. Do the little until 42:55 Speaker 1: the Takanoag, man. Well, you were saying though, the people that have issues, 43:00 Speaker 1: so that's the peep some of the people that are gonna have the issues are the 1 sipponate. 43:04 Speaker 1: Just say you're taking 200 mgs and the doctor says that you take 1 shot on Mondays and it's poof, 43:09 Speaker 1: that's going to yield more problems because you're taking a big dose. So you could do 43:14 Speaker 1: propanate 43:15 Speaker 1: 4 to 5 times a week, 43:17 Speaker 1: ideally every other day, but let's just, you know what I mean? So 43:21 Speaker 2: that will eliminate some of those problems. So that would be 1 of the reasons. I think men who are prone to, you know, estrogen issues, men who are more on the overweight side, 43:29 Speaker 2: who are trying to get into your, you know, that because overweight, 43:32 Speaker 2: you also are going to have higher estrogen issues also. So I think that going into the propionate initially 43:37 Speaker 2: would be a good But then you got, if you're doing this on the bodybuilding side and you're running gear with this, right, and you're trying to lean out, well, propionate is the best way to do it because you have less water. Less water where you want that drier look. Right? So it depends on the person. But if we're just talking What's the objectives? Yeah. Let's look the objective. If you're just talking about just straight health, start them on the probe, you know, do, again, you know, frequency, lot of frequency. Is that where you usually recommend is probe? No, I don't. 44:01 Speaker 2: I don't know. I I just sip in it in that thing. Because it's the most common. Exactly. His comment is 44:06 Speaker 3: A lot of people react poorly. A lot of people will have a lot of PIP- Yeah. Is great. Let's talk about that. That's important. That's important. 44:14 Speaker 1: Hurts. 44:15 Speaker 1: Let's explain PIP because I would imagine there's a lot of guys that have had it and they're like, what the hell is going on? Let's explain PIP. It happens. To everybody. Your body, your muscle is getting a very foreign substance in it. And the- You got a big lump in your butt. You- And you're pretty much like the muscle- It looks like it's a bunch a bitch. Substance injected right into the middle of your muscle. Okay. 44:35 Speaker 3: But 44:35 Speaker 3: test prop, 44:37 Speaker 2: it all just floods in you right now. Right? And that our muscles don't like that. Yeah, it's fats. Don't know. It comes in quick and it's like you said, the response on that could be painful. So that, again, that's why 44:48 Speaker 2: propionate is really popular because you don't really get that effect so much with the sip and you get the help. But 44:56 Speaker 2: again, got to talk about too. People sometimes get sensitive to what is in the testosterone. Remember, 45:02 Speaker 1: we should talk about this too, is the oil, right? Let's talk about it because it's been very common for me that has been a very 45:09 Speaker 1: curve ball that was thrown in mind because I thought I had it pretty dialed in. But fairly recently, 45:15 Speaker 1: was getting PIP constantly. 45:16 Speaker 1: And like, I mean, for anybody that gets PIP and you're getting where you're getting those lumps and you're getting those big painful things, there's ways that you can diminish it or like eliminate it to a degree, which is heat up the oil in hot water. That helps. Almost rarely, you rarely almost get it. So if you get that and you're prone to that, like, I can be just heat it up in water for about a minute, 30 seconds, whatever. You're gonna hit the oil when you inject it, then it's, you know, a lot of liquids. And then go run a mile as soon as you get that work out. Like, don't don't sink. Get that blood flowing. Get that shit out of you. Get your muscles contracting and getting it put, get it posted. Yeah. The NCT oil is going be the, obviously the 45:53 Speaker 1: healthier oil. Like 1 of the reasons that I've used switch from getting it from 45:59 Speaker 1: the doctor at the farm at like a pharmacy is because it's usually with like, what is it, like, 46:04 Speaker 1: grape seed oil. It's gonna be cottage seed, sesame, or grape seed. Is it sesame and CBS? I thought it was grape seed. Grape seed. Grape still a seed oil. 46:11 Speaker 1: All seed oil. So it's unhealthy. And so like a lot of people that, a lot of men have switched to the MCT because it's just a better oil. However, 46:19 Speaker 1: like it 46:20 Speaker 2: can turn on you, which it did for me recently. Yeah, if you're sensitive to MCT-0P, because a lot of times it's derived from coconut, then you're going to have a problem, know? And you could go with any oil. I was taking it. Sesame is a highly sensitive, 46:33 Speaker 2: you know, on food list. You know, a lot of people don't do well with sesame. So you can inject sesame oil and 46:39 Speaker 1: it could cause a problem. Out of nowhere too. Like you cannot have a problem because I didn't have a problem with MCT forever. And then all of a sudden, I was getting pit everywhere, like in my right butt, and I was doing it everywhere. I'm like, dude, what is going on? Will and I were talking about it. So like I called Doctor. Melanotan, which is, he'll be on here soon. 46:55 Speaker 1: And I said, Hey man, like this is going on. He said, well, you're taking MCT? Said, yeah, he's like, so for some reason MCT starts to turn on people. He And he didn't really know the why exactly, but he just Body just making me sensitive to the body. It's like, I don't want it anymore. It could be that the body eventually gets a sensitivity. Very interesting. It happens with foods. It can happen with, obviously, anything. A lot of changes, man. Sometimes it's the benzobenzo 47:13 Speaker 2: benzoate or the benzyl alcohol that is actually in the testosterone too that people could be sensitive to, or when it was produced in a lab, 47:21 Speaker 2: in a compound pharmacy, 47:22 Speaker 2: maybe 47:24 Speaker 2: there was a little bit difference in the amount of benzobenzoate 47:28 Speaker 2: or benzyl alcohol that was placed in. 47:31 Speaker 2: Those little variations sometimes can make a big difference on that same issue. Right? Another reason for, I mean, if 47:38 Speaker 3: you happen to be this person who's not getting it from a pharmacy and like these 47:42 Speaker 3: esters are all, these testosterone esters are all at certain levels, right? At the same levels 47:48 Speaker 3: for a reason, right? Like test proper usually is 100 mgs per milliliter, right? Ccipient is usually 200, maybe 2 50 mg/ml. 47:56 Speaker 3: S test E 2 50 to 300, right? There 47:59 Speaker 3: is a reason that those are there. If you make a testosterone and it is too dense It'll hurt. It's gonna hurt like hell. Yeah. I've tried it. It's not fun, right? Like, yes, it's not fun. Like, it takes everything out. So 48:12 Speaker 3: there's a reason to be like, oh shoot, I wanna get to test E-500. No, you don't. No. They 48:17 Speaker 3: love it, though. People love it, man. No, they don't. They don't like test e 500, 48:21 Speaker 3: see 500. That hurts amazingly 48:23 Speaker 3: now. So 48:25 Speaker 3: Yeah. 48:27 Speaker 3: Yeah. So 48:28 Speaker 3: that's it for Esther's. Anything else? What are you taking? What Esther do you take? I just dip well, I was on any athlete now. I just flip to Sip Uni. K. 48:36 Speaker 2: MCT is good with you? C A MCT C A? I use C A MCT oil in all my stuff. So I gotta make sure it's the C A MCT, but I do well with that. It's healthy oil. I feel, you know, way better for You can tell folks like like looking so good C8 MCT is is 48:51 Speaker 3: not very thick. Kind of it's a lot thinner, kind of looks like almost waterier. 48:56 Speaker 3: You can use a thinner needle, which is nice. You can use a thinner needle. If you have like grape seed oils, it can almost look purplish. That's 49:03 Speaker 3: what and thicker, 49:05 Speaker 1: bad quality of the CT will be kind of clear but thick, you know? And it's just not dispersing your body. Well, you know, MCT is the thinnest of those oils. I remember when it came out, I didn't know that it was the stuff I was getting was MCT and I'm like, what the hell is this? Like, because it was like the water. 49:23 Speaker 1: Is this water? What is this, but it feels funny, man. Alright, what other questions we got for you? Yeah, dude, that was great. So I wanted to kind of tell you a little bit of shift of what Scott and I, just like Will and I talk about through so many things, like Scott and I talk about a lot of things and recently, 49:36 Speaker 1: so, 49:38 Speaker 1: anybody that follows my channels knows I'm a carnivore and I've done some different things in 49:42 Speaker 1: my diet last 3 months of last year. I've got off well, I did some blood work with Scott and my inflammation was up a little high. I was eating 49:50 Speaker 1: shitty food and like I was working a lot and like my right? Like, he's like, dude, you're eating carnivore. You're eating, like, crappy carnivore, but I was getting home late and I wasn't cooking steaks. I was getting, like, Chipotle a lot. Dirty carnivore. Yeah. He's like, you're a dirty carnivore, bro. You remember that? Yeah. You're a dirty carnivore. 50:06 Speaker 1: But, anyway, so my inflammation was high. So, anyways, like, we we got off. Put me on some vegetables with my gut to do good with. But anyways, long story short, I did carbs for 50:14 Speaker 1: the last 3 months. I enjoyed it from the standpoint of, man, I got buff really quick. Obviously, 50:20 Speaker 1: we knew that, but I got a lot buffed than I even expected because I was on carnivore for 5 years. Now, 50:25 Speaker 1: as I go back to carnivore in January, 50:28 Speaker 1: 1 of the things I've been doing is I have, I fast Monday through Friday and at least a 20 hour fast, three-24s. 50:37 Speaker 1: I fast so much during the week because I work and I like to be focused, blah, blah, But I wanted to say, keep the buffness, 50:43 Speaker 1: know? So you and I were kind of talking through it a little bit. So here's what I did for anybody that's interested because it's worked really well. I've really enjoyed it. So I've always ran test SIP or test E. I've never really run a P test pro because I used to get, it used to not work well with me. So it wasn't really, I hadn't done it in years. 50:59 Speaker 1: And so Scotty and I were talking, Doctor. Scott- 51:03 Speaker 1: You call me Scotty. We're talking like Will and I just, we love this stuff. We like to talk through stuff. So anyways, what I did guys is I 51:10 Speaker 1: have instead of Tuesday and Thursday, 20 hour fast, I'm not fasting at all. I'm eating breakfast. 51:16 Speaker 1: I'll eat before I lift, which is man, I never do that. But I eat before I lift, you know, a carnivore protein shake and some eggs. 51:23 Speaker 1: And then I lift and I'll even go home and then another carnivore shake and some eggs or some sausage, blah, blah, But I'm eating like 4 meals, 51:30 Speaker 1: if not 5 on Tuesdays and Thursdays. 51:33 Speaker 1: And I have switched, so I'm cutting out the cutting down the fasting. 51:37 Speaker 1: I'm adding more food, more nutrients, 51:40 Speaker 1: and I've switched to the test probe right 51:43 Speaker 1: before I lift 4, 51:45 Speaker 1: if not 5 days a week. 51:47 Speaker 1: Dude, it's worked great. It's been amazing. 51:50 Speaker 1: Huge shift, huge pumps, and I'm keeping a lot more muscle on than I expected. 51:54 Speaker 1: It's been great. So the point of that is like do different stuff. 51:58 Speaker 1: Haven't done that forever. I get so caught up in my like ways because I'm OCD. 52:05 Speaker 1: Know what mean? But like, that's great. Great. It's, and it's good to talk through this stuff, listen to this stuff. You know, if you're just getting into this stuff, watch this stuff. It's so intriguing. It's so important. And you're only going to get better 52:16 Speaker 1: at feeling better 52:17 Speaker 1: if you educate yourself on this stuff. Because we love it. We talk about it. We all have, we all, everybody that's in our group of friends, that's just our life, 52:25 Speaker 1: you know? But you gotta like try different things, 52:28 Speaker 1: try all the esters and then see which 1 works. Try fasting. If you have inflammation markers, fasting is amazing. I'm a huge advocate. You 52:37 Speaker 1: and I were talking when we're running my blood work 52:39 Speaker 1: that you thought 1 of my saving graces for some issues were the fasting. 52:44 Speaker 1: Because I fast so much. So 52:47 Speaker 2: those things all play role to that. So many benefits to fasting. 52:51 Speaker 1: So that's it. We're almost done. 1 52:54 Speaker 1: thing that 52:55 Speaker 1: I wanted to bring up, which we'll just talk on, this could be a probably a whole podcast, which maybe we'll do that. But 53:02 Speaker 1: yesterday or whenever when I recorded the Q and A, 53:05 Speaker 1: somebody asked a great question. They were asking a question on a couple of the mitochondria 53:10 Speaker 1: peptides 53:10 Speaker 1: and the way that this guy articulated it both right when I read it was like, dude, that was a great question. He was asking, 53:16 Speaker 1: so should you 53:18 Speaker 1: take MOTS-1.0 in the morning and 53:21 Speaker 1: then SS-31at 53:22 Speaker 1: night because how they work and like how they work on the mitochondria because they're very different. MOTS-1.0 53:27 Speaker 1: revs it up. 53:28 Speaker 1: The SS-31will 53:29 Speaker 1: repair it, blah blah blah. So he and I answered it differently in different forms and it was a great conversation. I've been thinking about it ever since because, 53:38 Speaker 1: and the reason I bring this up is you and I were talking after you took MOTS-1C for the 1st time, you're like, Woah, 53:43 Speaker 1: You were like calling me, my wife was like, Dude, what's wrong with you? You know? And I'm like, 53:48 Speaker 1: like, I don't ever feel like that. Like, I felt left out. Like, I'm like, Dude, that sucks, dude. So it's generated a conversation in me and the thinking through this because I'm so intrigued by this stuff. 53:57 Speaker 1: So 53:58 Speaker 1: I know we've touched on a little bit, but I know people are going to want to hear this. So if somebody takes MOTS-3C like you and got rep, you were just like, Woah! And like me, that like, I didn't feel anything. Is 54:09 Speaker 1: it mean that your mitochondria is healthy 54:11 Speaker 1: when you don't feel it? Or do you is it somebody have a mitochondria that's like on a healthier side if you feel it more? That's it right there. So I needed it. So you were lacking. 54:21 Speaker 2: You know, it's interesting because people who are extremely fit, 54:25 Speaker 2: who exercise a lot But you do. I do too, but I'm not like you bro. I just, I'm not like you, JD, You're 54:31 Speaker 2: man with that. But I'm just saying like, there's lot of other things that play into that, you know, like stress and things like that can play into this whole issue also. So depending on cortisol, just depending on the person. 54:42 Speaker 2: So I needed it. Okay. So this is why like NAD didn't do a thing for me. Right? Because 54:47 Speaker 2: I'm probably good with that. Right? It doesn't mean you shouldn't take it. It doesn't mean you shouldn't take it. And same with MOTS-3.0 It's still good for you to take it. Okay. And 54:56 Speaker 2: I think it goes even with SS-31also. 54:58 Speaker 2: It's like, man, it's so good for you. It's like you shouldn't just not take it because any amount is going to benefit you. You know what mean? But you just nailed it, dude. Like the reason why So if feel it, if I don't feel it, that means your mitochondria is healthier. Exactly. As far as that system of that mitochondria goes, there's 55:15 Speaker 2: different parts. Remember how 55:17 Speaker 2: it all works. There's a whole different body. So SS-31 repair. Very different. Yeah. 55:22 Speaker 2: I think you see 1 that actually can go to the cytoplasm, the nucleus. Then of course we know that 55:28 Speaker 2: SS-thirty 1 55:29 Speaker 2: the- Repairs. The membrane of 55:32 Speaker 2: the mitochondria 55:33 Speaker 2: and keeps that- It's like a- Keeps the- 55:37 Speaker 3: Hardnesses all that power. All the power is going in, so it just keep it all Skeleton, man. It holds it strong. Yeah. Skeleton of the mind. So the answer to that question, actually, have thought about this, folks. It's been on my mind since. Thought about it. We've we've talked to to so, hey, should I take 1 in the morning or the night? Yeah. 55:53 Speaker 3: Don't think that really matters. They're still getting into you. I do both in the morning. He does both in the morning, I do them both at the same time. But the better answer was, hey, should If I have a start 1 56:03 Speaker 3: before the other, like a month before, which should I do? The answer is you should do the SS-thirty 1 1st. Because it repairs. You want to build that, that's well, the mitochondrial wall essentially needs to be strong 56:18 Speaker 3: 1st, right? We're building that, that needs to be 1st before 56:33 Speaker 2: good. Well, you're still getting good benefit with the MOTS-three hundred- 56:36 Speaker 2: of lipolysis, of blood sugar regulation, right? I mean, just that itself, MOTS-3s is gonna benefit you. Right? You know what mean? So it's not like, okay, 56:45 Speaker 2: you don't have to do SS-thirty 1. If you just want to do MOTS-3one, you're going to get a benefit out of because there's so many benefits to it. Right? But I think if you're gonna do it like, hey, I wanna do both. I wanna do start with 1. Yeah. Definitely start with SS-thirty 1 and then bump into the MOTS. See, that makes more sense. Makes more sense to me. I mean, maybe someone else out there will say something different. They will. 57:04 Speaker 2: But I mean, studied it. I thought, okay, it makes more sense to kinda do the SS-thirty 1. They have bring in the MOTS. And then again, you don't wanna stay on it either. Right? You don't wanna stay on it too long. Right? So you gotta bump off the MOTS quicker than you do the SS-thirty 1. SS-thirty 1, can ride that a little bit longer. MOTS-one 160. You know, MOTS you 57:18 Speaker 1: can go in the other direction if you kind of stay on it too long and, know, you want to cycle MOTS-1C on and off. Well, 1 other thing that we talked about yesterday, because you and I were talking a little bit through text yesterday, which really was intriguing with what you sent me, I sent it to Will, 57:31 Speaker 1: was intermuscular. 57:33 Speaker 1: Oh, that was a freaking trip, bro. Like Will and I even like Will like responded and we were thinking, I'm like, wow, that's so I did it this morning. 57:41 Speaker 1: I did 57:42 Speaker 1: an intramuscular this morning because of what you sent me. Was interesting. Do you realize that a lot of studies on Peptide's been around for a long time. This is not new. They've 57:50 Speaker 2: been studying this since the eighties, right? And they've been running a lot of Breast has been running for a my god, this is not 57:55 Speaker 2: new stuff. So do you know that a lot of the studies are done intramuscular? 57:59 Speaker 2: There's 1 called Cerebrolysin. 58:01 Speaker 2: Cerebrolysin. That 1 should be done intramuscular. 58:03 Speaker 2: It shouldn't be done sub q. That 1 should always be done. There was never any studies done sub q on cerebrolysin. It's always been intramuscular. Well, it's also been, I think, IV too. IV and IV. Yes. IV and intramuscular. And MOTS-3C was done. Studies are done, guess what, intramuscular. And 58:18 Speaker 3: they say it works better though. Yeah, I did this morning, so we'll So he sent that to us and I thought back and I have actually heard from several people like, well, 58:27 Speaker 3: girls who have like, well, I was on semaglutide, but I did my 1st 2 shots of the doctor's 58:32 Speaker 3: sub q, then the 3rd 1, same dose. Doctor gave it to me in my arm and I was sick for a week. Like, it worked that much better. That's interesting. That much more effective. It's muscular. 58:41 Speaker 1: Wow. And I've heard that from a few people. Yeah. Oh, I never oh, cool. So that's interesting stuff, man. I mean, that's something that we've never really discussed on here. Real quick, because we're almost done, but I did we didn't touch on something that I wanted to touch on. It's important. 58:52 Speaker 1: You ladies, we don't wanna forget about you ladies. I know because we get questions all the time. We're men, so we talk think about men a lot, but we love you ladies. You you'd smell good and you're beautiful. Because 59:03 Speaker 1: we, 59:04 Speaker 1: know, Will and I have seen women 59:07 Speaker 1: and how testosterone replacement, and it's just a little bit of testosterone changes their freaking lives. Wow. Sex drive, same stuff. So talk a little bit about the women because man, we get so many women reach out to us and I'm sorry we got so caught up and we could talk for literally hours. Let's talk a little bit about that. Yeah, I think, yeah, definitely man, this is huge. So I think like women, especially going into, you know, perimenopause, 59:28 Speaker 2: start going off, they'll start having the dryness down there. They'll start having the dry goes down, the energy goes down, and they start getting a little bit more fatty tissue around the abdominal area. Grumpy. 59:39 Speaker 2: Well, yeah. I mean, grumpy, that's easy, 59:42 Speaker 2: JD. 59:44 Speaker 2: My wife's not doing it. But yeah, I mean, and again, like micro dosing that a woman with testosterone is a game changer. And my wife's going to watch this because my wife has been through this and we've done several different ways of working testosterone with her. You said it's done wonderful. It's a game changer, not just on 1:00:01 Speaker 2: those effects I just spoke of, but the blood work I saw. My wife always has had problems with anemia and it's just no more anemia. That's pretty common. She used have to take a nap every day. She doesn't nap anymore. Mean, it's just rad. 1:00:12 Speaker 2: Of course the libido is better. It's always nice to have that when you're married and know why it's important. Your ears, man. It's important, right? 1:00:21 Speaker 2: But yeah, again, remember all the physiological 1:00:24 Speaker 2: effects here are 1:00:26 Speaker 2: for women too. How about this? This is really important women. A When woman goes into menopause, guess what happens? She started losing bone density. 1 of the biggest causes of menopause is osteoporosis. 1:00:36 Speaker 2: What's going to counterbalance that? 1:00:38 Speaker 2: HGH and testosterone. Was gonna say this. Let's 1:00:42 Speaker 1: forget 1:00:43 Speaker 3: about It's 1:00:45 Speaker 1: little it's a critique. Right? Which is it's shit. Yeah. It's a critique. So, again, yeah. But these It's so true, though. It's so true, man. The women should run TRT, 1:00:53 Speaker 1: and they should throw in some HGH or secrete. I mean, let's do let like, 1:00:58 Speaker 1: you we can age so well, everybody. Like, we do not need to age like shit. The science is there. 1:01:05 Speaker 1: Don't feel like shit. Like, we can age so well. 1:01:08 Speaker 1: Don't be 1 of those uneducated 1:01:10 Speaker 1: people in my comments going, yeah, you're cheating and all that stupid stuff. Educate yourself and have an educated opinion on something that you're gonna comment on because that's stupid, man. You can age well. Men are supposed to have testosterone, 1:01:23 Speaker 1: dude. If you're in my comments leaving those comments, that means you don't have testosterone because men don't do that. They're working and they're they're 1:01:31 Speaker 0: Ultra running shoes are all about space. 1:01:34 Speaker 0: The space to go further, 1:01:35 Speaker 0: to feel better, 1:01:37 Speaker 0: to do something you never thought possible. 1:01:39 Speaker 0: And this space starts with Ultra Fit. Unlike traditional running shoes, Ultra Fit gives toes more room to move naturally, so every step is strong, balanced, 1:01:49 Speaker 0: and comfortable. Whatever you're lacing up for, stay out there with Ultra. 1:01:54 Speaker 0: Shop now at ultrarunning.com. 1:01:56 Speaker 0: That's altrarunning.com. 1:02:00 Speaker 1: In their ass. I'll just be honest, man. So literally, bro, like, you can you can feel like a 31 year old. That's how I will explain it. We'll end on this. That's how I explain it to a lot of people that I work with is remember 1:02:12 Speaker 1: how easy it was to get in shape at 31? Do you remember how you felt at 31? You remember when you lifted weight, you didn't have to eat so strict at 31? 1:02:20 Speaker 1: Testosterone replacement, if it's done properly, will bring you about to that. 1:02:25 Speaker 1: And if you do that, you'll feel great. You'll be able to lose weight easier. 1:02:29 Speaker 1: You'll, when you work out, you'll see results. Like if you have like 2 50 testosterone, 1:02:34 Speaker 1: I don't care how hard you work out. You're not going to see much results. Yeah. Yeah. So even if testosterone be in And we have a 1:02:40 Speaker 3: question 1:02:41 Speaker 3: from the audience. Oh. This is a woman. Uh-oh. 1:02:45 Speaker 4: How would women you're gonna have a this question is my question. How would women 1:02:50 Speaker 4: be comfortable asking their doctor 1:02:53 Speaker 4: about possibly adding HGH into their, 1:02:57 Speaker 3: like- Oh, that's a great question. Won't you want to repeat it? Repeat it and then answer would feel 1:03:04 Speaker 3: comfortable? How would they approach their doctor 1:03:07 Speaker 3: about asking if they can take HGH? Oh, I'm sorry. Don't go to a medical doctor. HGH 1:03:12 Speaker 3: for them. And how what could they say to get their doctor? It's very rare though, even for men though. HGH? 1:03:17 Speaker 2: Very rare. Well, I mean, hopefully 1:03:20 Speaker 2: the nice thing would be is that you have a doctor that you 1:03:26 Speaker 2: feel comfortable with, just ask him anything you want. There shouldn't be a hesitancy about, oh, should I ask for this? I mean, what is he gonna do? Yell at me? It's not a good doctor. Know, it's a bad bedside manner. So make sure you got a good physician that you feel comfortable that you want to work with. And then of course, I'd say like, 1:03:41 Speaker 2: you know, I'd say more like you said, JD, maybe more of a functional doctor, you know, that's a little bit more friendly on that side. I mean, I think it's important, you know, you're going run HGH, especially if you're getting up in those age, especially 50 and plus where your HGH levels just decline. It just declines. 1:03:58 Speaker 2: It's like it's all great. It is. It's just like, it's just, it is what it is. I think that, 1:04:04 Speaker 2: being like able to just to feel comfortable and making sure to that, like 1:04:08 Speaker 2: you should get screened. 1:04:10 Speaker 2: Remember, HGH makes everything grow, right? So God forbid, you got something hiding in your body. 1:04:17 Speaker 2: You can run some labs and to kind of rule out 1:04:21 Speaker 2: potential 1:04:24 Speaker 2: cancers, carcinomas, 1:04:26 Speaker 2: things like that. Probably a good idea. You gotta check blood sugar. HGH is gonna lift blood sugar. 1:04:31 Speaker 2: You could counterbalance that, we know, with certain Fasting, 1:04:35 Speaker 2: Retrutide, 1:04:37 Speaker 2: know that IGF-1LR-three? 1:04:40 Speaker 2: Yes. That actually can counterbalance and bring balance from the elevated HGH. That also bring that back down. So, you know, again, just doing things right, but feeling comfortable with the doctor, 1:04:50 Speaker 3: I mean, ask them. So what are the is there some like clinical prescribing criteria 1:04:56 Speaker 3: that a person needs to be aware of so they don't shoot themselves in the foot and then not get prescribed HGH? 1:05:02 Speaker 3: You know, well, HGH. Or is that like, basically the question is like, yeah, or how do you game the doctor into giving it to you? 1:05:10 Speaker 1: Gonna talk about it. You're gonna go to a doctor that knows what he's talking about. If you go to a doctor and he runs total 1:05:15 Speaker 1: testosterone, that's what he runs, go to a different doctor because the fact that he just did that and you're trying to get your testosterone, 1:05:20 Speaker 1: your hormones checked, and he runs total testosterone, 1:05:24 Speaker 2: wrong doctor. Well, look at this. What is HGH for? 1:05:29 Speaker 2: For kids bones. 1:05:30 Speaker 3: For patients. 1:05:32 Speaker 2: And AIDS patients. So 1st of all, an insurance company is not going to pay for it. You're not going to get prescribed to you. 1:05:37 Speaker 2: If you're going to ask, probably want to Your regular insurance GP will probably not do it for you. You're going want to go to an anti aging clinic, a functional Those medicine 1:05:48 Speaker 2: are 1:05:49 Speaker 2: the people who are going to prescribe that to you. 1:05:52 Speaker 1: Outside of your 1:05:54 Speaker 2: insurance because I don't think you're going need to prescribe it. It's worth it because you're not going stay ahead of you. Don't have a problem growing that, you know, a 12 year old kid, they're going to give it to you if he's short, right? You'll get it prescribed. But 1:06:05 Speaker 1: if you're a woman in her 40s or 50s, you're looking to just, you know, that's called, you know, that's enhancement. Yeah, they figure that as, you know, it's more of an enhancement type of So you're gonna pay outside of That's a good answer. Lastly, let's close on this because I'm getting this literally on a daily basis. I get it literally almost on a daily basis. So like I'm getting so many questions from parents 1:06:23 Speaker 1: mainly my DMs about now 1:06:26 Speaker 1: high school kids are wanting to run peptides. They're asking about the growth hormone peptides. They're talking about the secretagogues 1:06:32 Speaker 1: and I get it almost on a daily basis. So I always answer it from a standpoint of, I am a father and what would I do with my son? So I'll answer this for a lot of people listening because it's asked so often and you can give your 2 sons too. So my answer is this, I'm not going to give my sons any type of growth hormones, creatagogue, anything. They are full of that stuff. 1:06:52 Speaker 1: I will give them when they're in their teens. I when they're playing sports and stuff, I will give them TB-five hundred or BPC. I I would for sure be doing that, and that's it. Anything else? 1:07:03 Speaker 1: God knows what he's doing, man. Kids heal quick. They bounce back quick. You're not gonna wanna blast your kid with growth hormone or secretagogue and even blast his own hormone. They're full of it, man. They're full of testosterone. You're not gonna give an 18 year old testosterone. He's full of it. So that's my answer. Do you have a different answer? Because it's asked I mean, outside of in practice, yeah, I mean, I use the BPC and the TB-500with a of children. So a lot of my athletes, you know, I treat athletes, kids are in high school. It has been amazing. Mean, I've had amazing things happen with knee injuries and 1:07:31 Speaker 2: shoulder injuries where these kids 1:07:34 Speaker 2: are back, mean, in 1:07:35 Speaker 2: a week or 2 weeks and they're just like good to go. So 1:07:39 Speaker 2: again, 1:07:40 Speaker 2: that's the limit. 1:07:41 Speaker 2: Far as HGH goes, if you 1:07:44 Speaker 2: have a child who's 10, who's super short, I personally 1:07:48 Speaker 2: My son's short. I'm short. I just say, Hey, I'm just like God trying to take over. I 1:07:53 Speaker 2: could 1:07:55 Speaker 2: probably get him on HGH, 1:07:57 Speaker 2: know? Like get him on it. And yeah, he's going to grow, but it's like, I don't want to tamper with that right now. He's 10 years old, right? I know a lot of parents are going down that direction because 1:08:06 Speaker 2: their kids are shorter in the class and they 1:08:09 Speaker 1: want the height. And then you got a lot of dads that are just trying to get your kid into being a professional Like listen, I'm blasting 1:08:15 Speaker 3: them with a heartbeat. 1:08:17 Speaker 3: Short to be athletic, I am. Great 1:08:20 Speaker 1: question though because like I said, it's like the questions that are coming through- But let me tell you something. What I'm seeing in the gym, I'm seeing a lot of the kid, MK-677s, 1:08:27 Speaker 2: while these young guys are doing the MK- That's common. 1:08:30 Speaker 1: I know 1:08:31 Speaker 1: people 1:08:33 Speaker 1: personally that have been doing that, but oh dude, 1:08:36 Speaker 1: freaking love you. Love you, bro. Yeah, you too, man. These 1:08:40 Speaker 1: 2 guys right here just like, 1:08:42 Speaker 1: if we can sit here and talk forever. We'll have you back on just because we love talking to you, dude. We get to do this for a living, dude. Like, oh my gosh, we were talking about the other day, like, do we sit here and talk like we talk like off screen? Hell yeah to do it on on a a podcast. How freaking cool is is sobriety? 1:08:55 Speaker 3: Although, 1:08:56 Speaker 3: although this is not a primary job that this this is the doing this podcast is not what what 1:09:02 Speaker 3: this is not my full time job. What's back there? Yeah. 1:09:06 Speaker 1: We were supplement company. Yeah. Fair enough. So there we go. But cool, man. I love you, dude. We'll have you back on. So everybody, 1:09:14 Speaker 1: I hope that you enjoyed it. We wanted to take a little bit of a left turn away from the peptides, but hormone replacement and peptides and diet, it's all about your health. So we will catch you on the next round. The next 1 will be, again, Will and I sitting down and talk about the Q and A episode, but this 1 will drop on Monday, which you'll be listening to it at that time. That's all we got.